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Re: Eclair Cameras: Eclair + Nikon

Wide angle is the problem when using 35mm lenses on 16mm.  A good 16mm
Nikkor lens will be outrageously expensive, and 16mm may be about as wide as
you can find.

If I were to upgrade my glass, I'd get a good set of used Zeiss or Cooke
primes and forego the hassle of the limitations of adapting to 35mm lenses.

Warren Yeager, SOC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mo Alexander" <mo007@earthlink.net>
To: <EclairACL@topica.com>
Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 12:42 AM
Subject: Re: Eclair Cameras: Eclair + Nikon

Hi, Todd

Thanks for the info. I'm going to test the Nikon mount lens and compare it
to my 12-120 zoom results. I'll also use the 50mm Nikkor that I have. But
what do I do about a wide angle lens?


----- Original Message -----
From: "Todd Anderson" <tanderson@alainjamar.com>
To: <EclairACL@topica.com>
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 3:53 PM
Subject: Re: Eclair Cameras: Eclair + Nikon

> Hi Vic.
> My tests aren't conclusive, so I don't want to come off as some expert.
> I will, however, share my results thus far. If your lens is the newer
> plastic auto-focus variety, I can't say for sure if the build quality
> would be up to standards. The "hellicoid" for focusing, or however you
> spell it, is looser on the auto focus Nikons. Your results may vary,
> but unless is was operator error, my test came back with the footage
> unsteady, alas, sharp. Again, these were just my simple tests. Also, as
> stated below, the "AI" manual focus lenses have a "throw" that is
> around 180 degrees from close focus to infinity. You have a much better
> chance of getting in-focus shots. These, along with all manual focus
> Nikon's, have a nicer "drag", too. It is a bit stiffer like a cine lens.
> You can pick up a Nikon 50mm f1.4 "AI" manual focus lens on ebay for
> around $100. This is about the sharpest Nikon (and luckily a bargain,
> as well)  I suggest you pick one up and use this as a basis for all
> your tests to compare what is possible with your camera. See how it
> compares to your zoom, as well as other primes. Just make sure you
> shoot some tests at a f4, which would probably give best results.
> I'm sure this has been said a hundred times before on this board, but
> the older Angenieux are a bit soft and grainy, especially at the wide
> angle end. I love the look of these lenses with b+w stock at the
> telephoto end (very kind to female faces), but I would only use them if
> that was the look your material asked for. Of course, everyone has a
> budget, so if that is all you can afford, go with it. Just don't expect
> a "glossy" look, which is not necessarily a bad thing. I have a
> Angenieux 9.5-57, which is the sharpest of the older Angie zooms, as
> well as a 12-120. You may also want to try to get a arri-standard
> mount, too. There are a lot of prime lenses for that mount-- Cooke,
> Schnieder, older standard Zeiss. A lot of people rave about the
> switar's, too. These lenses go for a couple hundred dollars and you'll
> need to find a solution for the wide angle end of your kit if you
> decide to use the Nikon's from 24mm and up.
> It should also be said that I've noticed that extraordinary results can
> be had in 16mm when the exposure and lighting are just perfect. I know
> this seems like a given, but it seems in 16mm, everything is that much
> more critical. Blacks get grainier quicker in the underexposed areas,
> and the detail in highlights can go soft quickly if overexposed. I've
> had unsatisfactory results even with my Zeiss's and Nikon's with
> overexposure footage that was telecined. I know that it is best to
> error on the side of overexposure with negative stock, but in my
> findings, the telecine can have trouble with this as well, if more than
> a stop.
> Anyhow, I'm just sharing the knowledge I've acquired.  Only test will
> give you the answer you are looking for.
> On Friday, March 7, 2003, at 01:58 PM, Vic Alexander wrote:
> > Hi, Todd
> >
> > I have a Nikon lens. It's a 28-50mm Soligor that I've used for stills
> > and
> > that I'm sort of happy with. I'm thinking of using it on my ACL. Do
> > think a short zoom like that will give me better results than the
> > 12-120
> > Angenieux zoom that I have?
> >
> > Vic
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Todd Anderson" <tanderson@alainjamar.com>
> > To: <EclairACL@topica.com>
> > Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 11:17 AM
> > Subject: RE: Eclair Cameras: Eclair + Nikon
> >
> >
> >> Hey Mark.
> >>
> >> I haven't seen you post in awhile ( I remember you as a fellow
> >> Beaulieu
> >> R-16 to Eclair ACL  shooter) I've just been shooting 100ft daylight
> >> loads, so I can't help you with the a-minima loads. What I can say,
> >> though, is just like the Beaulieu, it just takes a few times to
> >> loading. Anyhow, I saw your lens question. If you have a good Nikon
> >> adapter, you'll be MUCH happier with your results using the Nikons. I
> >> have some Zeiss superspeeds and Nikon's, and the Nikon's are as
> >> and in some respects better--in the few tests I've done. There's a
> >> catch, though. They do not perform as well wide-open as the Zeiss's,
> >> and more importantly, you can only use the Nikon's from 24mm and up.
> >> Otherwise, there is too much glass since you are using a superwide
> >> fish-eye Nikon--the contrast is not going to be good. Also, make sure
> >> that you get "manual focus" Nikon's. The loose build quality on the
> >> Auto focus lenses can make the image jump like a jack-rabbit. Also,
> >> and
> >> this is very important, Nikon makes "AI (older)" and AIS (newer)"
> >> manual focus lenses. Get the "AI" lenses. The reason is that the
> >> focusing scale on the the "AI" lenses is closer to 180 degrees,
> >> verses,
> >> 90 degrees, just like on cine lenses. Meaning, it takes twice as long
> >> on the "AI" lenses to focus from 1ft to infinity. Why is this
> >> important? It means that you have finer control in focusing. Twice as
> >> much space between 2ft and 3ft etc.
> >>
> >> So I would suggest getting Nikon's from 24mm and up, and maybe one or
> >> two wide angle primes (what ever you can afford). I like the look of
> >> the older Angenieux's with B+W film stock With color I think the look
> >> is a bit dated and grainy, in my opinion.
> >>
> >> I'm finally sending one of my ACL's to get converted to Super16. I
> >> can't wait.
> >>
> >> Todd
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thursday, March 6, 2003, at 04:23 PM, Marc Syp wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Hi all.
> >>>
> >>> I tried to search the archives but had trouble logging in to Topica
> >>> (or getting a new password, for that matter).  Anyway, I know you
> >>> have discussed this before but I'd love to get a few tips.  I'm
> >>> planning, finally, to test out my ACL with film.  I have 2 rolls of
> >>> the new Vision2 500T that are on 200' A-Minima rolls.
> >>>
> >>> 1) First things first... I don't have any core adapters.  Is that
> >>> going to kill me?  Here's what I do have:
> >>>
> >>> (a) Two complete 200' daylight spools, which I could use for takeup
> >>> if
> >>> absolutely necessary.  I hear that this can add to the camera noise,
> >>> though, so I"d like to look into an alternative.
> >>>
> >>> (b) On disassembled 200' daylight spool and an assortment of cores.
> >>> Unfortunately the cores don't just slide down the spindle of a 200'
> >>> spool, so I'll have to work something out with the flat flange side.
> >>> I
> >>> have contemplated glueing the core to the flange, but I don't want
> >>> lose the whole apparatus when I get it processed.  Perhaps I could
> >>> ask
> >>> the lab to return the spool/flange assembly?
> >>>
> >>> 2) Could some kind soul give me some tips on loading a 200' magazine
> >>> in general, and also more specifically the A-Minima loads? I do have
> >>> an ACL manual and a changing bag.  However, I think I read a while
> >>> back that the A-M loads have the emulsion facing the opposite
> >>> direction of regular loads?  Please send me any tips.
> >>>
> >>> 3) P.S.  I'll be using an Angenieux 10-150 in excellent condition.
> >>> Or
> >>> should I get some good 35mm Nikon primes (I do have an adapter)?
> >>>
> >>> Thanks!
> >>>
> >>> Marc S.
> >>> (can't wait to shoot)
> >>>
> >>> _________________________________________________________________
> >>> Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
> >>> http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >
> >

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